Rural income- backhoe? Water tank?
 

My uncle put forth an interesting proposal. His suggestion is to invest in a backhoe with assorted attachments, as this would allow yo to do a wide variety of jobs for odd money here and there.

He says that expenses (besides the obvious expense of the machine itself) would include a pole barn, flat-bed and something to haul it with.

Forestry, stump removal, snow-ploughing, road building, construction, field tilling, dirt/gravel loading, etc.

Anyone here have experience of knowledge?

Can you put a well-drilling attachment? I know they use augers.

Cost?

Training, licensing, insurance issues?

Upkeep?

:wavey:

My idea was to get a water tank trailer or two, the kind they used to water us in the field sometimes in the military.

I've got a free clean potable water source, I thought that if stuff got weird I could make water deliveries.

Re: Rural income- backhoe? Water tank?
 

I used to work for a guy who made his living with 2 backhoes. He had plenty of work. The main thing we did was septic systems. The only thing your post prompts me to say is like any other trade you have to know what you are doing, which seems obvious but it is probably the larger issue than the start-up costs.

Re: Rural income- backhoe? Water tank?
 

I have a neighbor with 2 backhoes....a Case and JCB. Both 4wd ( very important feature IMHO ). He uses the JCB with a rock hammer on the hoe instead of a bucket, and gets a lot of work breaking out rock for foundations. The Case he bought new about 8 years ago.....75k and the JCB, used (WELL used....like near worn out ), about 25k. Also takes a heavy ( 20ton ) duty float, 3 axle, and a dump truck to haul the float/backhoe. Additionally, he has a 450 JD dozer, and Bobcat steer skid loader.

He stays pretty busy, but it took him quite a few years to build it up. Weather knocks him out of work a lot ( has rental properties also ), machine payments and repairs/maintenance take a lot, insurance costs are fairly high, and pays a lot of taxes on equipment/tags/etc...

He started about 15 years ago with a really old piece of crap backhoe his brother had bought and tried to make a business out of ....and failed....but this guy made it work until he could finance a new one.

One thing to be VERY careful about used machines is they are often real pieces of crap.....and even brand new ones have a nasty habit of blowing hoses, etc, on a regular basis. If you own a backhoe, plan to get to know your local hydraulic line maker REAL well. :biggrin:

Also, if you plan to do septic work, many places it requires a state license to install them, as it's a public health issue ( TN does ), so be aware of that.....

A backhoe, though quite versatile, is not a "do all" machine if you plan to get serious about earthwork....you'd need a dozer for road building/general grading, and a track front end loader for real excavation....not that a backhoe can't DO that, it just doesn't do it near as efficiently. They are primarily for digging holes/trenches, and loading LOOSE material. For example, I can hire a guy with a track front loader to dig out a full basement for a house.....100/hr, but he will do it in 5-6 hours. Same basement with a 75/buck/hr backhoe would take 16 hrs. Which one is cheaper ? But a track loader can't dig my water line trench, my footer trench, or a nice clean 8x10 hole for the septic tank......

Re: Rural income- backhoe? Water tank?
 

:553: OK...here's some input...take it for what it's worth.

I own quite a few pieces of heavy construction equipment...too much to list.

First priority...scrap the backhoe idea...you'll basically work yourself to death using any backhoe...unless you intend to actually drive it from job to job since it has rubber tires...consider it an obsolete piece of machinery.

My advice from construction experience ?

1-Buy a small compact excavator around 30-40 HP...that's the 4 to 5 ton weight range.Rubber or steel tracks...rubber is fine for not tearing up a customer's lawn,but if it rains or you're working in questionable or rough terrain the rubber tracks will be your worst nightmare...I prefer steel for various reasons.
Komatsu,Kubota,or Yanmar compact excavators seem to hold up very well under heavy use with minimal maintenance better than other brands.

2-Buy a skid steer loader...any brand except Bobcat (POS).
I know lot's of guy's in the forestry and construction trades...none ever bought a second Bobcat once they got rid of the one they were stuck with...I'd rather use a shovel than a Bobcat skid steer loader...it's more reliable and won't beat you to death operating it like a Bobcat will...just MHO.
New Holland or Case...much more reliable and mucho higher build quality.

3-You're going to need a serious dual or tri axle trailer...imagine that. :>)

4-You're going to need a serious truck...not some shiny 1/2 ton suburban grocery hauler..invest in a used dually...preferrably 4WD...loaded equipment trailers don't pull so well in mud or even light rain...a 2WD dually is borderline acceptable.

Why am I so down on backhoes even though I own a Ford 655D ?

Simple...a simple job like digging foundation footings,ditching,septic tank work,or a simple huge hole in the ground will take twice as long to do with a backhoe as it will with an compact excavator.

As far as just moving dirt...as in clearing brush,trees,driveways,or just moving dirt from point A to point B a skid steer will run a circle around a backhoe in total volume vs time spent.

Yeah,yeah...I've probably POed a few members already who own backhoes...they'll get over it...I know I did.

:biggrin::bear_w00t::biggrin:

Added: For serious versatility you're going to need a single axle dump truck( single dump cylinder only...avoid double dump cylinder models like the plague )...preferrably an under CDL weight model...unless you have a CDL driver's license already...beats the crap out of a dually pickup in pulling power and it's so nice when your customers want gravel,mulch,sand,etc.
Later down the road you might want to buy a track loader or medium sized dozer if you plan on doing heavy clearing....my CAT 953 track loader paid for itself in a year doing heavy duty land clearing...of course that kind of heavy equipment will lead you to expensive lowboy trailers and a Peterbilt...and a CDL license will be a necessity...whether you like it or not.

Piece of advice: Avoid heavy equipment auctions like the plague...your chances of getting a deal are mighty slim...buy used from a local dealer or an individual...right now it's a buyer's market...to be sure you're getting a fair price check the online heavy equipment auction results as a starting point.

Good luck :>)

Business ?
Hmmm...I have to hide my equipment to turn away business.
If people see heavy equipment sitting in your yard they instantly assume you're for hire.
They're not shy...I've never advertised...word of mouth,good work,and reasonable rates are the secret of success.

Re: Rural income- backhoe? Water tank?
 

Ford 665? No wonder you hate backhoes! :aetsch:


+1 for the compact excavator, and +10 for the skid steer loader. The machines are SO versatile. From brush shredding to sand spreading to hole digging to...well, you get the picture. We've owned a case uniloader for 10+ years, and it was worn out when we got it. It still does an incredible amount of work and is VERY reliable considering it's about 3x its normal useful lifespan.

I'm looking for a replacement right now. You need to consider what attachments you're going to be using and get a machine that has the weight, horspower, and hydraulic flow to run it all. Right now you can get used ones fairly cheap. Oh, and you'll have to have tracks, either a tracked machine or external tracks.

Now, keeping the machine busy is a different story. If you don't have a reputation in your area I would think it would be hard getting your foot in the door at this time. The most important thing is to do impeccable work and be honest and timely. Folks will balk at a high price, but over time you're better off having a reputation as being expensive than a reputation for shoddy work.

Re: Rural income- backhoe? Water tank?
 

Anyone have any ideas on 'urban' farming tractors?

Something bigger than a rototiller and smaller or perhaps just better than a small farm tractor? For crop production as well as breaking up new garden beds and dealing with rocks, virgin subsoil or pasture as small as few thousand square feet [and efficient up to several acres]?

Re: Rural income- backhoe? Water tank?
 

Something like this?



http://www.jimsrepairjimstractors.co...ader_small.JPG
John Deere 317 Garden Tractor
$5600

Re: Rural income- backhoe? Water tank?
 

Great advice!!! Thanks for the great input.

I suppose with two separate pieces of equipment I could partner up with someone to get stuff done even quicker.

Didn't consider it before. I guess this is why it's good to ask questions.

For a steel skid loader, is it just as important to have tracks as it is on the compact excavator?

Also, are there any licensing requirements to operate these things (except the septic tank installation)?

.

Re: Rural income- backhoe? Water tank?
 

Where I live jobs needing that sort of stuff done is normally done "on the side" by someone who has access to a backhoe - whether it belongs to the city, their boss (who gets a cut), or whoever. But we have a lot less need for backhoe/digging/drilling work here than the rural US, so the situation is probably very different.
Plenty of the guys I've hired have been happy to work for a day if kept in beer and GOOD (fatty, home cooked!) food, and sent away at the end with a few $10 notes and a bottle of bourbon. If you do the manual labour, it's not a hard job for them to twiddle the switches and throw the levers about.

Re: Rural income- backhoe? Water tank?
 

Agree with RiverRat on Bobcats as a real POS. The only advantage to them is that it's easier to get replacement parts for them (wonder why?) than New Holland. For one thing, the arms are way under-designed- crack city. In my biz, I've bought about 9 skidloaders over the years, they are kinda a disposable item in a foundry, they tear the f' out of them. I've bought Bobcat, New Holland and Case, my money is on the New Hollands, great hydraulics and strong arms!

Re: Rural income- backhoe? Water tank?
 

How about this. Pull behind a 4x4 atv http://www.kunzeng.com/tillease-featurespage.htm

Till-Ease Model 543 Chisel Plow / Cultivator

Re: Rural income- backhoe? Water tank?
 

Lot of good equipment thoughts being put out on this thread ...here are a few of mine

I own a Plethera of equipment...(own a commercial construction company)
i can take anything home i want any time

I will agree somewhat with River Rat,

Each piece of equipment has a specialty

If i am digging trenches i prefer a Excavator of the appropriate size

If i am moving small quantities of dirt etc...i like the versitility of skidsteers with attachments

A dozer with a 6 way or loader is a very good thing (D5 size is good)

that all being said.....what do i keep at the house to mess around the farm...

I keep a Cat 416c backhoe 4wd/cab with a thumb attachment...i can dig..grade..load..trim trees..transplant trees..pick up and move things..etc
my point is a good backhoe is not perfect for anything but good for most things

I also keep a Gehl track skidsteer at the house with forks..and smooth and toothed buckets....

If i had to work with just two peices of equipment these are the ones i currently choose most often

If you work in soft or muddy soils a lot Track machines are the way to go

Each tool has its purpose but a good backhoe is amazingly versitile, i am thinking about this winter building a skidsteer attachment plate to put on one of the backhoes instead of a bucket ....to attach my skidsteer tools too

Re: Rural income- backhoe? Water tank?
 

I can't speak for your area but where I live EVERYBODY owns a backhoe or an excavator.

My step-son and I recently had a conversation about this and we started naming all the people in the area that own excavators [big ones]. There are at least 10 within a 5 mile radius of my home and I live in a rural area. With a nice used one running $100k or more I am surprised so many people have these things sitting around.

Many farmers own their own backhoes. They are everywhere.

Re: Rural income- backhoe? Water tank?
 

A buddy of mine quit his 35.00 hr. job at Chevron, cashed out the 401k, and bought a backhoe (deere) and a small dumptruck. His wife wanted him around home more often. He had to commute 450 miles to his job, so he would be gone a week at a time. I tried to tell him that there were 30 guys at least, advertising backhoe work in the local free paper. Plus, THEY knew what they were doing. Short story, he's back working at chevron, sold the equipment at a loss after just 2 years, blew through the ENTIRE 401k, walked away from his home, and moved the family down south, to be close to work.

Only do it if there is a guaranteed amount of work, and you know how to operate the equipment! Like someone else said, out in the country, EVERYONE has a backhoe!

Re: Rural income- backhoe? Water tank?
 

River Rats post was spot on. When I used to repair water and sewer mains I spent between 10,000 and 30,000 a year on the maintenance of my excavator and track loader. Not to mention the trucks and trailers.